(8:30 PM — Since ten million Nats fans are dropping by wanting more info, let me post a link to another article I wrote a week ago or so on Morgan for you where I called for our GM to send him to 3A. Morgan is an extremely poor defender in center regardless what UZR thinks of him — he is excellent on side-to-side routes but freezes on anything hit at him which leads to too many balls going over his head or dropping in.
That being said, I’m in the minority camp that believes he has more potential offensively (OBP mainly) and ‘09 isn’t going to be his career year. You stole a plus makeup guy with a tick offensive upside Rizz was smart enough to see, but he was a liability in CF for us. We get two projects and McCutchen is probably the only guy Lastings will run smoothly with giving us a chance to get something out of him, be my best guess. You won unless Lastings does a 180.)
I liked the Hinske deal for two propects who will always be minor league fillers, and I love the fact Morgan and Burnett are gone and Milledge is in.
But Hanrahan? There we got ripped, and don’t come here telling me about upside with this guy – there is none. Huntington should have demanded a lower level prospect with some true upside instead of the Hanrahan project. Rizz must be laughing pretty good right now.
What is also hilarious about this trade is that Tony Milledge, Lastings’ pop, and I were hanging around Bradenton watching McCutchen after he was drafted in 2005 and I told Tony I had heard Lastings was on Pittsburgh’s radar screen (Mets inquired for a player and Littlefield uttered Milledge’s name, I heard at the time). He laughed at me and then said, imagine an outfield with Andrew and Lastings. You know the rest of the story.
The chemistry Morgan and McCutchen had will be much the same between the two Florida boys of McCutchen and Milledge. They are hot zone players who hate the cold (second-half type guys), they are both laughable and fun guys to be around, and they will become two peas in a pod together. This trade helps both of these youngsters and the results will be immediately felt.
But one question begs to be asked..
- who plays left field now, especially at PNC? There is no possible way Milledge can play left at PNC so perhaps McCutchen gets moved to left at PNC and Huntington prays Milledge can handle center? That’s really, really stretching it. Perhaps Moss in center? Naw, that’s insane. Moss in left? Still a huge stretch. Garrett Jones? Good gosh, tell me that’s not going to happen.
We’re stuck.. we don’t have a left fielder who can cover the ball at league average rates or better. Truth be told, we don’t have anyone who can cover the ball even at below-average rates in left.. just marginal coverage. So you have to think Huntington has another trade lined up that will bring in a speedier left fielder with a little pop because he doesn’t do this trade knowing he’s lost 30 to 40 runs saved (Morgan and McLouth vs Cutch and Milledge).
Does he?
Naw..
Would I have done this trade? No. I mentioned the other day Milledge for Morgan was lopsided in the Nats favor and we needed a lower level prospect (B to B- at least) to even it out. Hanrahan is junk as is Burnett because of his limited role as a lefty specialist (a role pretty much getting written out of today’s game), so this deal becomes Milledge for Morgan. Without a deal in place for a left fielder, we lose significantly on this trade if for no other reason than Milledge gets too expensive too fast combined with the loss of defensive runs saved. I don’t want money going into the big team, as a fan I want to see it turned into stupid money to sign youthful players and staff right now we’d never get without it.
Is it the type of deal that kills us? Lord, no. It’s pretty insignificant, to be quite blunt although Pirates’ fans won’t see it that way. I seriously doubt Milledge is around very long because after his first year of arb in 2010, unless his game picks up, he won’t be worth the $4M+/- he might get in year two arb.
And Dear God, please Frank and Neal.. do not approach Milledge to buy out his arb years. Make him play to get paid.
How about Salazar to play left in PNC? I think this deal works out for us in the long run. I commend Neil for taking a chance on Milledge despite the baggage. I bet Joe works wonders with Hanrahn. I like the fact that desspite 2/3 of our outfielders being gone that Pearce is still not playing!!!
Bill
laughable post keep it coming
Jake i have to disagree on this deal with you a bit in i like whats coming back- Nyjer is 29 probably at his high end already peak wise. Milledge still has talent only 24 has 6 to 7 times the pop Nyjer has not sure on his ground he can cover. Left is extremely tough at pnc to play for anyone Nyjer played it well but he had his blurbs out there occasionally. Moss is a better left fielder on the road, not sure how he can play there until Milledge is ready to play there at home. Burnett the remaining headcase he developed into a decent reliever but his stuff is very fringy at best 88-90 on the heat has trouble having batters miss and I think Hanrahan at this point has more upside needs the work of Kerrigan to work with him. Remember how bad Chavez was with getting hit all over the park.
Who has the most projectability in terms of tools and performance between Morgan, Milledge, Moss, and Jones? You have to assume Milledge, but what makes anyone think a bunch of losers (yes, the players, management, and owners are losers because they lose alot) can iron out his head case tendencies.
I’m tired of the players’ epic complaining. Wow, he brought a lot to the clubhouse. Cool. Fans don’t pay tickets for a good environment in the clubhouse. They cry a river about being 6 games back/under 500. Congratulations, if I did my job less than 50% of the time, im pretty sure I’d get chopped too. What are the odds that the Pirates fire Russell and get a Therrien-esque (sorry for the hockey analogy) manager? We have to start improving our fundamentals and changing the attitude for any of these trades to matter.
I’m surprised you didn’t mention Jack “poppin off” about the deal.
This is addition by subtraction and will ultimately lead to a Capps trade sooner rather than later.
Don’t forget Hanrahan pitched in the WBC plus his FIP is in the low 3s. In other words his arm was stretched out too early and has had some very unlucky bounces.
Neal will make Millie and Hanrahan earned their stripes. No free rides anymore in the Burgh.
> Who has the most projectability in terms of tools and performance between Morgan, Milledge, Moss, and Jones?
Tough call.. Morgan and Milledge are both streaky guys but each offer other pieces to the puzzle.
> What are the odds that the Pirates fire Russell and get a Therrien-esque manager?
Hilarious. Someone mentioned last year that we seemed to need the services of Dr. Ruth more than John Russell.
How bout that 7th inning guy tonight? So what was it tonight ? Luck,The cubs sorry lineup,a pissed off team? Enlighten us. Thats 7 wins brainiac
Are you seriously trying to say a 4th OF’er in Morgan is not worth the potential of Milledge?
Pirates cant go for mediocrity, they have to go with deals like this……..low risk high reward types.
This is really getting comical. Will you ever like a move the Pirates make? Even Keith Law said the Pirates got the much better end of this deal.
I’ll go one further EVERY baseball pundit is praising the deal on the side of the Pirates.
LOL – not everyone, but certainly most. But I’m not the kind that jumps off the cliff because everyone else does too.
In three year Lasting might be an all star. Nyjer might be 32. Old joke, I know, but I don’t care what the stats say, I watch the games. Nyjer does stuff to get a team hyped, but he also gets caught stealing too much. He plays average defense to be as fast as he is. He cannot bunt and he’s still learning. We got a guy who can do all that and is 5 years younger with much more upsides for Duffy, Allensworth, Tike, Adrian clone.
Jake,
My tip of advice would be to stay consistent on your opinions because we all noticed.
One day you want Morgan demoted and continously bash Sean Burnett and when they are traded for a guy who has an upside you aren’t happy. Hanrahan was a throw in and I’m not going to pretend he is any better than Tyler Yates or Craig Hansen.
Milledge is 24 and was rush through the minors. He put up okay numbers as a 23 year old in a terrible lineup last year and could eventually develop into a guy who his 20 homers and 30 stolen bases.
If Morgan was 23 years old I would be hesitant but Morgan is going to be 29! He is nothing more than Juan Pierre at best.
What will make Jake happy? I can agree with you on most things Jake but I don’t think you can bash this deal. We have to wait and see and Burnett and Morgan just don’t have that much value. If you took a positive approach once in awhile you might have more readers who value your opinions. If you are negative about everything you knowledge goes right down the toilet
This is seriously baffling. Calling for Morgan to get sent to AAA one day, then complaining we couldnt get more for a guy who he wanted to “bat 9th behind the pitcher so we can eliminate his worthlessness as much as possible”. But now that he’s gone, he has more offensive upside. And now all of the sudden Morgan and McLouth (a guy you bashed daily) are better defensively than Cutch and Milledge. You flip flop more than sandals on a speedwalker.
I come here because its one of the few Pirate sites which gives some great insight most of the time. But stuff like this ruins credibility.
are u related to John Kerry? U flippity flopity Too mucho. U trashed Mclouth and Morgan and when they deal them u trash them for the players in return. I guess ur consistent in ur writing pretty trashy.
Come on Jake, you did say Morgan should be demoted a little bit ago, and now you dislike this too? You would have prefered we send him down to AAA and just play the game? Honestly, what do you want us to do? Besides get the guys only you like….Maybe management is not doing a great job, but I wonder if anyone could ever do well with the criticism you place on them. Its always darned if you do, darned if you dont with you. I dont understand this one from you at all…..
The funny thing is that he wants Morgan sent down but wants a B-B- level prospect on top of Milledge for him?
“I mentioned the other day Milledge for Morgan was lopsided in the Nats favor and we needed a lower level prospect (B to B- at least) to even it out. “
Those are your exact words…..
Jake you says this now but you wanted him sent down not to long ago.
Bash the Nuttings all you want, I have no problem with that…..but at least be consistent in what you want.
The constant negativity when there is none is BS and you know it.
50 million elvis fans cant be wrong
I too think Morgan has the potential to do better in the future and for this to not be a career year. I also have not been the least bit surprised by the #’s he has put up. EVERY TIME in the past that he has gotten to play daily he has posted similar numbers. Not saying he is a star or even should be a starter, just saying I felt before the year that he was better than people were giving him credit for.
If we want a winner in the next couple of years I think we have a better chance with Milledge than with Morgan. We need some more pop in the line-up and Milledge brings much more pop without losing too much speed. In a dreadful line-up last year, in his first full year in the majors, at an age when many players are in their first full year of minor league ball, he lead the Nationals in G, HRs, RBIs, SBs; 2nd in Hs, Rs, 2Bs, and struck out less than 100 times. If he can build on that and post betters #’s we’ll think of him less as a “headcase” and more as “eccentric”. Until he quit on his team, the fans in Boston were pretty happy with headcase Manny.
What’s all the hate for Hanrahan about, Jake? Not even saying anything about “upside” because upside infers getting better in the future; I’d just be happy with him doing what he did last year (which is better than Grabow did 4 of his first 5 years).
What’s the big deal with shipping out our everyday LFer? NH and Coonley are building this team for the future, everyone on our roster is expendable with the exception of Cutch.
If they are getting 5 tool prospects in return, I say line them all up and ship them out. Especially for 29 year olds.
Hanrahan has a power arm, you can’t teach that. Let Kerrigan work his magic, maybe he can teach him how to utilize his arm.
I see from the next article that Jake and/or his sources are speculating that Hanrahan’s shoulder is toasted, which would explain all that hate for the guy. But if we DO test the guy now and he is injured, then can’t the trade be recended or modified? I seem to recall something like that happening with a trade to Boston involving Mike Gonzalez.
hmm.. I assume you don’t consider Milledge a ‘bona fide star’. Who in the Pirates system, comes anywhere near matching Milledge’s credentials? Cutch has almost as fast of bat speed, better pitch recognition – perhaps, and his speed on the base paths is better than Milledge’s.. three solid tools. But Cutch doesn’t have his A+ arm nor does he have his power ceiling.
I’d even have put Gonzo in the package instead of Burnett if they wanted him.
We had a chance to get Milledge in the past, but declined to build a package to get him. You get a lot of bagage with Lastings, altho his pop will tell you the baggage is vastly overblown.
Milledge is gonna bust. It’s his 3rd team in what, 2 or 3 years? Bucs aren’t done trading either. This article is funny. Sports Satire – Pittsburgh Trades Stargell’s Career; 1991 NL East Crown
wanting Morgan sent down to get his head screwed back on doesn’t have much to do with this trade. I saw Morgan like almost everyone else did – a 4th OF with plus makeup, some OBP potential, and playing a nice left field defense. But when any player gets 200 AB hitting below .160 at the top of the order, it’s time for change and that’s why I said he needed to go down.
As for the trade and my remarks seeming like they were inconsistent, I think I made it perfectly clear that I felt we were trading OUR everyday outfielder we didn’t have a replacement for to the Nats for an unproven commodity with huge amounts of baggage we wouldn’t be able to afford when/if he ever does come around. That’s hardly inconsistent but if it seems that way, perhaps I should have worded it differently.
Generally you have good insight but every time a player slumps a little you don’t send him down. Don’t give us that garbage you wanted him sent down to “screw his head on straight”. You made it evident that he wasn’t a worthy starter and was proving it. Send him down would have been a mistake and you know it. 200 at bats and hitting below .160??? Where do you come up with your numbers?
NOT INCONSISTENT!!??! In that very post you are being inconsistent. You said you viewed Morgan as a 4th outfield and a little while later said he was our starting outfielder. Yes he was starting in left but if you view him as a 4th outfielder that means he isn’t starter quality.
Stop with the defensive garbage too. I am absolutely sick of reading posts about how Cutch isn’t good enough defensively but you were all pumped up about who great he was a month ago and how much of an upgrade he is over McLouth. Nate might not have been the best defender but you make it seem like Carlos Lee is playing centerfield for us.
You begin to lose credibility with your lack of being consistent. I have read your blog for the last few years and was around when you said you couldn’t do it anymore. But you have gotten worse with your analysis. Just stick to one story and keep it there stop changing your mind and if you do thats fine but ADMIT WHNE YOU ARE WRONG!!
Wanna keep talking about Matt McSwain?
Ok Ray.